Old English Bulldog

Boondox · September 2012

grr.. So here's the story. I had a friend I new from high school reach out about a FREE (4) month old - old english bulldog. A lot of people wanted her, but I ended up with her.

she's the cutest thing and I've owned a blue nose pit in the past. Yesterday was her first day at my house and she deffinatly needs some time to adapt; however, we are trying to crate train. At first, I was against it and did a lot of research on crate training and it doesnt seem like a bad idea. Always keeping her next to me in the crate (in the living room usually). The crate is perfect size for her and she goes in and out freely with the door open. I've been feeding her in there to (recommended for adjustement). Anyways, last night she threw up about (3) times ..twice on me. She's doing better today. This is my first experience with a bulldog and I had no idea they were so stubborn!! They CHEW horribly and drool everywhere. Which is bad... because of my 7 year old nephews toys. That's beside the point, she's only 4 months old and were training her. I just wanted to post something hoping maybe someone has had experience with the breed or breed type? I also learned an Old English Bulldog is mixed with pit, mastiff, american bulldog.. and I think that's it. I only have a few concerns with her... (1). She was FREE -going price for this breed is $1500+ (2). She was going to be put down... due to Mange. now... I didn't know off the bat she had mange, but I fell in love with her the second I saw her. Now that I have the knowledge of it... I'm just nervous about it being the spreading type. she's not itching, no open wounds just very small (almost healed) spots of missing fur. couple on her ear and one on her leg. I'm taking her to a vet as soon as I can (calling in today) to see what type she has and treatment. I REALLY need help training her though, she's not like other dogs. She needs to be potty trained, she knows sit... she needs to be able to come off leash as well. thats one of the biggest ones. So other than my own independant research, I would love to here any feedback!! Hopfully it will help me out some. : ) Yes, she has her shots. She's chipped and I'm waiting on more info. on the breeder. Supposidly, she came from a "good background" with approved parents. We're looking into getting her approved as a therapy or campanion dog as well. OH, before I forget... word came in that this is an AGGRESSIVE breed?? I was warned to watch out for other animals; however, she's met (3) other dogs under my control and did fine. So... hopfully that's not that case. If it is, like I've said, I've owned a blue nose before and yes... she was aggressive towards other animals, but it wasn't severe. We got the pit when she was about 1.5 years of age and the previous owners didn't socialize well. Thanks for taking the time to read all this, any tips or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. She snores to with those little wrinkles x D SO CUTE!! I'm just worried about the mange and training.

FlyTM · September 2012

Erm... Shouldn't you take her to see a vet than? if shes said to have mange and if you believe they are a aggressive breed I would say a lot of socialization. (I don't know much about the breed becuase I'v never looked up about flat face dogs, I don't like them, due to breathing problems and such..) Training puppy school? would help with socialization as well.

Kazuko · September 2012

I have a friend whose family has bred English Bulldogs for twenty years, if you have any breed/type-specific questions, let me know. First off, Bulldogs are KNOWN for being stubborn. They aren't like pit bulls who are super eager to please. Bulldogs are stubborn stubborn stubborn. Think of them like a Juggernaut with four legs. They CAN be trained, obviously, I believe Avla has a girl English Bulldog, you can try and contact her too. Feed your dog slowly. Very slowly. Either a handful at a time, or get a slow feed bowl (like <a href="http://dogmilk.designmilk.netdna-cdn.com/images/2010/11/dog-bowls-slow-feeders.jpg"; target="_blank" class="bb-url">these</a>) Bulldogs are known for choking on their food or getting bloat. Honestly, I would not have suggested getting a bulldog whatsoever without having done at least a year of research. They may have 'bull' in their name, but they're really nothing like pit bull terriers. Take her to the vet, and see if you can contact any Olde English breeders via email to ask questions. Just explain the situation ("Hi, I have acquired a young Olde English Bulldogge puppy because she was otherwise going to be euthanized. I was wondering if you could answer some questions, as I am not very experienced with this breed." would be a good introduction.) and see if they can help give advice. Any dog can be aggressive and dangerous if not properly socialized. I have met one Olde English, one Australian Bulldog, and several regular English Bulldogs, and they've all been wonderfully friendly animals. You will HAVE to put effort into it. This means daily trips where there are people/other animals. Pet stores, parks, etc. Even some hardware stores will allow animals (Tractor supply stores, Home Depot, etc). But call beforehand to double check. I've wanted an Olde English Bulldogge for a few years now, so consider yourself lucky.

Troglin · September 2012

First thing that I want to point out is that the Old English Bulldog is a separate breed entirely from the American Pit Bull Terrier. Bulldogs are not, in any way, a 'pit bull'. The only way they would be classified as a 'pit' is due from media and public generalizing all bully-looking breeds into one category. Each of these breeds has their own set of personalities/temperaments and pros/cons. Bulldogs in general have a stubborn type of demeanor. They can be the laziest dogs you could ever meet, or they could be very high strung. They're not an 'aggressive' breed. They can become protective of their owners and their property, but the level of actual aggression will depend on you. It could be an aggressive dog if it isn't socialized or trained properly, but no breed is aggressive by default. Your puppy will need a lot of firm direction from you. You will want to make sure she knows her boundaries. Mental and physical exercise is going to be vital for her if you want her to be a happy dog. Just make sure you pay attention to the heat due to her short nose. As far as aggression towards other animals goes, it is possible to have prey drive of smaller animals. This is just something that you should be able to prevent with solid socialization and training. If you can, you'd want to introduce her to cats or smaller dogs. I've never personally met a bulldog that was aggressive towards anything, but you can't really go wrong with extra socialization. Now as far as the mange goes, as long as it's demodex (which is more likely) then it will not be contagious to you or other animals. If it is sarcoptic mange, you + any family member + all animals will need to be separated. The house would need to be washed and disinfected. If you haven't started scratching yet though, it's more than likely going to be demodex. Mange is actually fairly easy to treat. I've gone through it with two dogs, and really the worst part is just trying to afford it. You can do mange dips either at the vets or at home, plus ivermectin orally. There's also a topical treatment they'll occasionally use for it, in place of the dips, but I can't remember what brand it is. Your vet would go over those options though, but definitely make sure to ask about at-home treatments. Vet treatment of mange can get really expensive really quickly. When I had vet dips for my first mange-dog, it was at $50 per dip and she was supposed to get them weekly. That was on top of the oral treatment and tests -- her first visit was over $500. Crate training will definitely benefit her for housebreaking. Just make sure you've got her on a solid, routine schedule. Same time every day for food, water, and potty breaks. When housebreaking puppies, a lot of people recommend taking the water up around 7pm, or 2 hours prior to you going to sleep. This way she doesn't have access to water that'll make her pee late in the night. For chewing, you might want to invest in some durable puzzle box chews and kongs. Never use rawhide chews as they can fall apart and could cause the dog to choke. Nylabone is a really nice brand and they've got a wide variety of edible and non-edible chews. If you get a name brand Kong, just know it can smell a little rubbery/tire-like for a while. It's definitely not something you should wash with your dishes or anything, unless you want your stuff to smell too. :P I made the mistake of doing that once, and I certainly learned my lesson! Also, to stop her from chewing your stuff, you can try a bitter apple spray. It tastes awful and it just gets sprayed where you don't want them to chew. Make sure you keep your mouth shut when you spray it though -- unless you wanted to sample it too. Some dogs are immune to it but usually they find it just as repulsive. If you can afford it, I would recommend getting her started on a high quality, grain-free food if she isn't already on one. Grain or other food allergies are fairly common in bulldogs, unfortunately. The lower priced foods are going to be the ones that could cause more of a problem, as they're stuffed with fillers, grains, and questionable meat sources. For training a good, solid recall, I recommend getting a whistle and making her associate a whistle blow with a treat. You would start with a pocketful of her favorite treat and stand there, with her on leash, and whistle once. Give a treat immediately. She should start to understand the connection within 10-15 whistles, and after that you can start on a long leash or off leash in a secured area. If for some reason she fails to recall off leash, I'd recommend making a lot of noise and running the other direction. Make her believe you've got something worth coming over for, and praise her when she comes over. A lot of people make the mistake of trying to chase their dog down, which then seems to trigger a game of 'catch me if you can'. Good luck with her. ^^

Kazuko · September 2012

My friend adds that skin problems are very common in bulldogs, and that it's probably demodectric mange. EDIT: Also, drool comes with the territory. Carry a drool rag with you. I also mentioned that you were worried about them being an aggressive/dangerous breed, and she just laughed. A lot. So I don't think you have to worry there, as long as you socialize her =p

Boondox · September 2012

THANK YOU ALL VERY VERY MUCH!! I read all posts. Alright so here is the update, she MAY have come from a bad or under-ground breeder... I called my local vet to see about the assistance to low income families and she (the vet or manager) was helpful, but very... cautious. She immediatly came off as if the dog is unhealthy and came straight from back yard breeding (which was a bit affensive, however I don't blame her concern). Our family is low income and that doesn't mean we are not capable of a dog, but the treatment process of mange is a very big concern. Since I just got laid off my job, but a vet visit is only $50. to start off with. Thank you thank thank you for the info on mange, I havn't had any experience with it myself and it is "scary" reading about all three types and not knowing which one she has, but I'm almost sure its the non-contagious one. She's still seperated from the other animals for now. I do need some more advice... about the breeder who seems to keep hiding. like I said, my friend "rescued" her from being put down and when I spoke to the local humane society they said in NO way should a dog be put down for mange. She also said the breeder is %100. responsible for all vet and health expenses. I'm praying I will actually be able to track down this breeder and hope it's not "what it appears". I was also recommended to Bully rescue centers, they may also help with the cost. I'm getting her shot records today, so we shall see who her vet was before and perhaps I can call them for further information. I'm just stuck right now with getting assistance and making sure she is as healthy as can be. I'm kinda OCD when it comes to animals, always keeping up on there baths and if they get sick... it's straight to the vet (just to make sure). So having this beautiful animal and remaining patient is testing. -_- I am repulsed if the breeder is MIA. Alright... Worst case scenario... Say I can not find the breeder and can't afford the health care... what happens to the dog? The local human society came off as if she may need to be put down, but she IS a very healthy looking dog. Other than the mange, her weight is great. She's strong, smart and the sweetest thing. When I say mange, she has maybe 3 or 4 very small spots that almost look like scaring (like a bite mark) on her right ear. One spot the size of a dime on her head , pin point spot on her back (barely visible) and one more mark on her left leg. I've seen mange cases and her's is very mild right now. Regardless, tomorrow she see's the vet. I'm just waiting on picking up her shot records tonight. She was free... and everyone I've told that to says there is definably something wrong with her if a $1500+ goes free and the breeder is MIA. Of course, I just got most all this information today and doing my absolute best with the given knowledge.

Boondox · September 2012

We also learned our lesson with feeding her. She gets a cup of dry food in the morning, a snack mid day and a cup at night. She was sick the first day, I had to do a lot of research on this breed. She's an absolute beautiful animal and I can't see any reason to be putting her down. I've got a lot more calling around to do and research. Thank you all soo very much! Please, all this is GREATLY appreciated. More advice on the update would be outstanding. I've had a dog my whole life, but never this breed and never this case.

Kazuko · September 2012

If you cannot afford an animal, the best thing for her is to find a home that can. It'll be easier for everyone that way. If she comes from a breeder, they are not necessarily responsible for all the bills unless it states so in the contract.

Kazuko · September 2012

Also note, bulldogs are EXTREMELY high maintenance when it comes to vet care. This will not be her last expensive vet treatment, I guarantee.

Boondox · September 2012

Kazuko wrote:

If you cannot afford an animal, the best thing for her is to find a home that can. It'll be easier for everyone that way. If she comes from a breeder, they are not necessarily responsible for all the bills unless it states so in the contract.

so with out contract and proper papers it's a dead end? I'd assume so. No, I mean we arn't made of money but we can certainly take care of vet bills if needed. It's just of course, Intimidating with the mange. I just don't know the ball park price range of it. If it's less than $1000 than it shouldn't be a big deal, specially on a payment plan. I'm just worried it may be a 3k+ up treatment plan. That was the price issue I was aiming at. The assistance from the local humane society would pay... I believe some where around 30%? I forgot the actually aid of it. Yes, I do aggree 100% if we can not afford tha animal, it is in no means fair to keep her. She wouldn't have a problem finding a new home either, I'd obviously just have to inform any potential adopters about her health care. : )

Kazuko · September 2012

Yeah, bulldogs are just crazy expensive. xD Between breathing problems, skin problems, bloat, hip problems... *dies* Plus you have to be careful that their wrinkles don't get infected and gross. The mange will be between $500-$800 I believe. Don't quote me on that though. My friend says bulldogs get so many skin problems though, so be aware that you'll need to make that particular visit more than once. EDIT And yes, without the contract you really can't hold them to anything unless you have proof that the dog was sold with mange.

Boondox · September 2012

Kazuko wrote:

Yeah, bulldogs are just crazy expensive. xD Between breathing problems, skin problems, bloat, hip problems... *dies* Plus you have to be careful that their wrinkles don't get infected and gross. The mange will be between $500-$800 I believe. Don't quote me on that though. My friend says bulldogs get so many skin problems though, so be aware that you'll need to make that particular visit more than once.

That is deffinatly something to take into strong consideration. I read all about those cute wrinkles, washing in-between them and making sure the eyes are kept clean as well. I want to give her a bath today, she should be fine with regular dog shampoo right? I read a lot of what was mentioned last night when we got her, so the key points mentioned are great. You're helping the puppy and me with all this information. x ) Very very much appreciated.

Boondox · September 2012

You know what... maybe this is just me, but she seems large for 4 months old. She's already maybe the size of an American Bulldog and big paws. She weights maybe 35lbs (I could be wrong) and maybe a foot and a half tall? O.o just thought I'd throw that out there as well. I looked up pics of OED and she deffinatly looks like a pure bred. I'll post some pics on this thread probably.

Kazuko · September 2012

If you can find a sensitive skin shampoo or something similar, that might not be a bad idea. Remember to not bathe her too often, however, as that often causes more problems than it cures. You should take some pictures though. She might be older than 4mo, you can't take anything for granted. xD

^Oriyana^ · September 2012

I'm not sure what people are referring to as "American Bulldogs' lately. A small American Bulldog should be bigger than a large Olde English Bulldogge. Chance from Homeward Bound was an American Bulldog. A lot of the people I talk to seem to be under the impression that American Bulldogs are of the short, squat build, and they're more boxy, leggy, like a boxer type, though heavier.

Kazuko · September 2012

For some reason people think American Bully = American Bulldog, Ori. It's confusing, I know xD

^Oriyana^ · September 2012

lol I know, I'm like, I really have no idea what you're talking about because I don't know if you mean the American Bulldog as the actual breed, or something else entirely. My brother in-law's cousin picked up a 6 week old bulldog puppy and brought it to the family's house a few Christmases ago. There were so many things I had to bite my lip on, the fact that it was 6weeks old, the fact they only paid like $800 for it and were talking all the time as if it were an English Bulldog (which I really think is what they think they had). At 6 weeks it really is hard to tell for sure since they are all pudgy and wrinkly lol. Then at some point they said the breeder referred to something about an American Bulldog, and I was like, they way you're talking you're not expecting an American Bulldog the way I know them to be lol. I think they expected a short, squat dog, and I was telling them American Bulldogs are taller. I saw a pic of the dog like a year later, definitely taller than an English, maybe closer to the Olde English stature, and I was like "told ya so" lol. Really have no idea for sure what that dog's breed was since I really question the quality of the breeder lol.

Boondox · September 2012

Oriyana wrote:

I'm not sure what people are referring to as "American Bulldogs' lately. A small American Bulldog should be bigger than a large Olde English Bulldogge. Chance from Homeward Bound was an American Bulldog. A lot of the people I talk to seem to be under the impression that American Bulldogs are of the short, squat build, and they're more boxy, leggy, like a boxer type, though heavier.

oh wow, I didn't know champ was one. x ) I'm posting pics right after this. Kazuko I have a "dis-infectant" shampoo. Might not be for sesative skin, may help though? or make things worse? Just good to know your point of view, you seem very knowledable about the breed.

Boondox · September 2012

Only have two of her so far, better ones will be coming soon. Just so you guys have an idea of her : ) <img src="http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n548/ssccrruubb/vixx.jpg"; alt="http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n548/ssccrruubb/vixx.jpg"; class="bb-image" /> <img src="http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n548/ssccrruubb/vix.jpg"; alt="http://i1139.photobucket.com/albums/n548/ssccrruubb/vix.jpg"; class="bb-image" />

^Oriyana^ · September 2012

She's cute

Alabama · September 2012

There are 2 breed types of "American Bulldog" I forget their names, one's Johnson which is a taller dog, like Chance and the other is a smaller breed type, similar in size to an American Pit Bull terrier. So they can be confusing. I'd looked all this up when I thought Buddy was an American Bulldog. That said, I don't think that dog looks like an Old English Bulldog, nose isn't "pushed in" enough and it doesn't have enough jowls. The head isn't square enough and the legs are too long. If I had to guess, I'd say it may be a cross with a taller breed of dog, but no telling what breed. She looks enough like a Pit Bull to have warranted the death sentence from the Humane Society, depending on their rules, but most likely they wouldn't have let her be rescued by anyone except a licensed rescue. This could be a good thing for you, if she's not purebred, she may not have all the problems associated with the pure breed.

FlyTM · September 2012

She looks too tall for a Old English Bulldog to me unless there is some new breed of Old English Bulldog thats change their height.. but the Old English Bulldog looks to me like that dog in the second movie of Garfield .. not really tall or anything. o.O' Erm.. if you want to look up about breeds I would say try looking up "Dogs 101" or "Breed all about it" they give good infor on all types of dog breeds. Too many breeds with the words American and Bull in the breeds names must be why.. American Bully American Bull dog American Pit Bull Terrier, the list could go on with how many breeds have bull in their name... Blehs xD American Bulldog is huge T.T... in height, I liked the one they used for chance just some of them are bred a bit Erm...

^Oriyana^ · September 2012

Okay I haven't seen the second Garfield movie but I'm going to assume you mean Winston? <img src="http://img.skitch.com/20100213-b2b3qcde46974fa7s5q1dh6mas.jpg"; alt="http://img.skitch.com/20100213-b2b3qcde46974fa7s5q1dh6mas.jpg"; class="bb-image" /> I believe he is an English Bulldog, or Bulldog according to the AKC and CKC. The Olde English Bulldogge was created to resemble what the English Bulldog used to be a long time ago, (the extinct breed Old English Bulldog), it isn't recognized by either the AKC or CKC. <img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Olde_English_Bulldogge_Crop.jpg"; alt="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Olde_English_Bulldogge_Crop.jpg"; class="bb-image" /> Wiki says there are generally considered to be three types of American bulldog: the Bully or Classic type (sometimes called the Johnson type ), the Standard or Performance type (also called the Scott type), and the Hybrid type. When I think of American Bulldog I think of the type like Chance, probably because this is the look I prefer ;P This breed is also not recognized by the CKC or AKC Apparently Sure Grip's Rattler who played Chance is considered the hybrid type, but I think he leans toward the taller/lighter look of the Standard. The Classic type was bred to resemble the original Old English Bulldog so it's a wider dog with a shorter muzzle. Apparently there are couple other sub strains. You learn something new every day lol. <img src="http://media.naplesnews.com/media/img/photos/2010/01/21/sh-homewardbound_t607.jpg"; alt="http://media.naplesnews.com/media/img/photos/2010/01/21/sh-homewardbound_t607.jpg"; class="bb-image" /> My brain kinda hurts now :P There are too many Bulldogs and Bully's lol

FlyTM · September 2012

Yup.. thats what I'v been thinking this was about the whole time T.T.. didn't know there was another with almost the same name, though I don't study them as I don't like them xD.. I have my reasons just like people who have their reasons to like them. Though the Olde looks better to me than the English Bull lol. The American bulldog, I love the chance's built and his head always have, I hate the one that everyone seems to breed around here, huge built, bull dog looking in the chest and face.. only once have I seen a chance looking one well two and that was two being walked o.O. Didn't know their was three different looking ones I may have to look them up. Agreed, (Learn something new.)I didn't even know there was even a different breed but I'v only ever seen the english bull, never heard of a Olde till now o.O I'v always know an English bull as an Old English Bull dog, must of been told wrongly I guess.

Kazuko · September 2012

Yeah, Olde English Bulls and regular English Bulls are two different breeds. The Olde English will have less of a pushed in face, will be taller and a bit more lean looking. She doesn't, to me anyway, look like a four month old puppy. She's in the long-legged stage you see normally in the 6-8month range. She MIGHT be an Olde English, but I don't find that extremely likely, she might be a boxer, pit bull or bulldog mix, judging by the long legs and muzzle-to-head ratio. Her face definitely has a sort of pit bull look to it from the front, of the non-gamebred variety. (Gamebred pit bulls are leaner, longer legged, thinner muzzled.) For now I'd hold off on using the disinfectant shampoo until you can ask a vet about how it will react with her mange.

Boondox · September 2012

Alabama wrote:

There are 2 breed types of "American Bulldog" I forget their names, one's Johnson which is a taller dog, like Chance and the other is a smaller breed type, similar in size to an American Pit Bull terrier. So they can be confusing. I'd looked all this up when I thought Buddy was an American Bulldog. That said, I don't think that dog looks like an Old English Bulldog, nose isn't "pushed in" enough and it doesn't have enough jowls. The head isn't square enough and the legs are too long. If I had to guess, I'd say it may be a cross with a taller breed of dog, but no telling what breed. She looks enough like a Pit Bull to have warranted the death sentence from the Humane Society, depending on their rules, but most likely they wouldn't have let her be rescued by anyone except a licensed rescue. This could be a good thing for you, if she's not purebred, she may not have all the problems associated with the pure breed.

We'll she is suppose to be pure bred old english, but she is only 4 months and already the size of an American Bulldog... infact she was taller than my neighbors. You're right though about the nose, the legs and the jowls. I'm now wondering how big she's going to be. o.O She's got a lot of extra skin as well, with BIG paws and thick legs haha. She does seem very healthy as well, other than possible mange which honestly, may just be scaring.

Boondox · September 2012

Oriyana wrote:

She's cute

Thank you! she is a little thug to haha, yesterday she played with the neighbors dogs. There was a 6 month old blue nose, a 3 year old blue nose and a big old lab. Unfortunatly, the older pitbull was way to aggressive with her so I had the neighbor put her inside. -_- I hate asking him to do that, but she's to aggressive with the other dogs. My pup was really shy at first so I started giving her treats everytime she encountered one of the dogs and ended up playing and having a blast. x ) She didn't want to come in either, her stubborn-ness came out pretty well that night haha.

Boondox · September 2012

Oriyana wrote:

Okay I haven't seen the second Garfield movie but I'm going to assume you mean Winston? <img src="http://img.skitch.com/20100213-b2b3qcde46974fa7s5q1dh6mas.jpg"; alt="http://img.skitch.com/20100213-b2b3qcde46974fa7s5q1dh6mas.jpg"; class="bb-image" /> I believe he is an English Bulldog, or Bulldog according to the AKC and CKC. The Olde English Bulldogge was created to resemble what the English Bulldog used to be a long time ago, (the extinct breed Old English Bulldog), it isn't recognized by either the AKC or CKC. <img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Olde_English_Bulldogge_Crop.jpg"; alt="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Olde_English_Bulldogge_Crop.jpg"; class="bb-image" /> Wiki says there are generally considered to be three types of American bulldog: the Bully or Classic type (sometimes called the Johnson type ), the Standard or Performance type (also called the Scott type), and the Hybrid type. When I think of American Bulldog I think of the type like Chance, probably because this is the look I prefer ;P This breed is also not recognized by the CKC or AKC Apparently Sure Grip's Rattler who played Chance is considered the hybrid type, but I think he leans toward the taller/lighter look of the Standard. The Classic type was bred to resemble the original Old English Bulldog so it's a wider dog with a shorter muzzle. Apparently there are couple other sub strains. You learn something new every day lol. <img src="http://media.naplesnews.com/media/img/photos/2010/01/21/sh-homewardbound_t607.jpg"; alt="http://media.naplesnews.com/media/img/photos/2010/01/21/sh-homewardbound_t607.jpg"; class="bb-image" /> My brain kinda hurts now :P There are too many Bulldogs and Bully's lol

awh! She is deffinatly the second picture. I'll have to look that one up for further information. Thank you so much! There are way to many bullies out there haha.

Boondox · September 2012

Kazuko wrote:

Yeah, Olde English Bulls and regular English Bulls are two different breeds. The Olde English will have less of a pushed in face, will be taller and a bit more lean looking. She doesn't, to me anyway, look like a four month old puppy. She's in the long-legged stage you see normally in the 6-8month range. She MIGHT be an Olde English, but I don't find that extremely likely, she might be a boxer, pit bull or bulldog mix, judging by the long legs and muzzle-to-head ratio. Her face definitely has a sort of pit bull look to it from the front, of the non-gamebred variety. (Gamebred pit bulls are leaner, longer legged, thinner muzzled.) For now I'd hold off on using the disinfectant shampoo until you can ask a vet about how it will react with her mange.

Hmm... she just may be a mix of some sort. Like I said before, I was totally expecting the typical common bulldog. The large muscle head looking ones like in garfeild. So when she came in, I deffinatly thought she was BIG for 4 months and looked nothing like I expected. She deffinatly does have a bulldog stance and I will have to take some more pics of her for a better Idea. The one pic does make her look like she has longer legs and the other pic makes her look as if she has a smaller jowl. Which she does have longer legs and a smaller jowl, just may have been the angle of it. : ) I'll get some more today, we going to the meadow for a walk soon. ^.^

Boondox · September 2012

hmm... so if she is the second picture posted, and not recognized my the AKC then does her value go down? She may be 6 months old, I think the shot records said her Birthday was 4/20 2012. My friends still holding on to them until she gets off work, then I'll be able to get a better idea. As for the mange, I'm not 100% if she really has it or what. Everyone who's seen her said they were bite marks (scars) but I'm still goin to the vet to be 100%. : ) AWW this is my first little bully! x ) She's doing soo good. Hardly any accidents in the house, we're getting out routine together for feeding's and walking. She's got a new big bone to chew on and loves carrots. ; P Training is becoming easier, just light training until she reaches 6 months (if she isn't already). I'm starting to get a lot more familier with her characteristics and behavior. As for the crate training, we're taking it slow. she loves the crate and I don't want to spook her by closing her in for to long. I've been locking the gate while she eats and as soon as she's done I wait a minute then open it. So far,so good. You all have been sooo amazingly helpful!! I've learned a lot from everyones response and it's helped a ton.

Kazuko · September 2012

Do more than light training with her. She may be young, but she's not stupid, so you can do all the basic commands now. Sit, stay, down, shake, speak, roll over, come, etc. Basically anything that doesn't involve strenuous activity/jumping/etc If you're thinking of her in terms of 'value', give up now. If you do not have papers from the breeder listing the lineage and that she is a purebred, she won't be worth much in the long run except to people who don't really know what they're doing, which isn't the sort of people I'd want to own a dog anyway. That being said, mutts can be worth a ton if you give them a fancy name. Olde English Bulldogges are currently similar to breeds like Labradoodle. They're just designer mutts being sold more more than your average house payment. EDIT: Comparison This is a seven month old OEB <img src="http://i.oodleimg.com/item/2821153381u_1x424x360f_dogs_in_crown_point_ny/?1322167067"; alt="http://i.oodleimg.com/item/2821153381u_1x424x360f_dogs_in_crown_point_ny/?1322167067"; class="bb-image" />

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Old English Bulldog

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