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Werewolf3 · March 2006

I know that people say we can't order people how to play the game... But it's annoying and kind of sad to see people playing this game with no concern nor regard for the dogs themselves... I know the dogs just data but how is such behavior teaching responsibility to the younger people that play the game??? It's NOT.... they're getting it into their heads that being responsible is TOO hard and have little to no regard for stats and the breeds - mutts - that they happen to breed together.... What I mean, is watching people breed their dogs like crazy and then whine about how they need money because they were too lazy to bother to train their animals, meaning that except for other lazy persons no one is going to be interested in buying their dogs. Such people complain that they're not sponsers... well there are some novices that still train their dogs to 100% in stats... I was one for six months before I updated my account. The above was a rant really, but you should get the general reason for my complaint/worry. So how about this? Not sure if it's possible but I'm going to explain it anyways Make it impossible to breed dogs unless they are closer to 100% in stats training... such as a mimimum breeding limit of 80% - in that the dogs have to have 80% stats before they can be bred... but this limit won't apply to aggression as herding breeds need low aggression. A lot of novices simply stop "training" when they get 280% in skills, well skills means NOTHING either for showing or the pups if the animals aren't at least trained to 100% in stats. Through this means, it will force younger players to be responisble for their accounts... and as more money is paid for pups from trained dogs - even novice trained - it will teach them that taking responsibility for whatever you are doing actually has its benefits as they will be getting more money than the average $200 charged for pups from untrained pups.

MaryamOvaci · March 2006

Again, this would completely disable breeding for conformation. It would limit conformation shows to foundation dogs.

deedee1 · March 2006

It is not the job of VP to teach people responsibility. Sure, I can agree that it is frustrating to hear people complain and whine and look for a handout when they are not playing the game in the most efficient and successful way, but I don't think that there should be preset conditions within the game itself to enforce successful/responsible/efficient playing. That is a choice that the individual player needs to make. The information on how to play the game in the "best" way (meaning the way that will make you the most money and create the best statted dogs) is readily available. For the most part, long time players are willing to share their expertise with new players. By allowing each player to make their own decision on how to play the game, the end result will either be that people play it the most successful way and do well, or they will not follow the most successful paths and end up doing poorly in the game and probably dropping it after a relatively short time. If a person playing VP is learning responsibility solely from the game, then the fact that they produce poorly statted dogs and run out of money is, surely, the least of their problems in life. For the same reason that television, books, movies and video games hold no concrete responsibility in what our youth are learning, VP holds no responsibility in the matter either. Sure, it cannot be denied that some kids are, in essence, raised by technology, and that their life goals and morals may be affected (sometimes for the worse and sometimes for the better, to varying degrees), but we must make some basic assuptions of human morality and say that MOST kids will be taught responsibility by their parents or guardians, school, church, community organizations, etc. and not put the responsibily into the hands of a computer game that, essentially, is created for the sole purpose of mindless entertainment for dog lovers.

Jinxx · March 2006

Actually, Nef herself said somewhere among the posts on the forum she'd like people to learn responsiblity in dog owning (not those exact words but similar) and she'd asked for suggestions. This had happened not all that long after the game started and some of us wanted rescues and were worried about the way some players were keeping untrained dogs and breeding litter after litter after litter. Guess I'll need to go looking to the post later.

Rebel912 · March 2006

I agree with BrunDrake and Jinxx... Id like to see people take more responsiblity for these dogs, almost as if they were real. Stats should be at least 70? I think thats reasonable. Of course, I dont think asking that dogs be 280% trained in skills is a lot. Thats very simple to do. *had to edit because I didnt read original post close enough* :oops:

loko_carloko · March 2006

I like this! A common misconception in new players is that, if a dog has been skill maxxed, it is a great breeding dog...*sigh*. I think the responsibility problems arise from the fact that, the player don't do it on purpose, they just don't know better. When I started playing, I ahd no idea what dogs were good and which were bad. I think that is the main problem, not direct irresponsiblity...So, my idea is to host 'class' type things in chat, where the *secret* tips are taught to players. Not the stuff in the Help files, but the stuff about not breeding untrained dogs, and Free Friday, and espcially the forum. Then, players questions can be answered. I think that is the answer to Vps problems

Newnameplacement · March 2006

that's a good idea loko.. I'd help out for a few hours once a week if this went through

The Impster · March 2006

I get LOTS of people asking me to breed their dogs... I ask only 2 questions, "Are they fully trained?" and "Are they siblings?" They must always be fully trained, and must not ever be siblings when I breed for people! I agree!

Newnameplacement · March 2006

i'm picky.. i'll go through the lines so i don't line breed at all too

Tara Rayne · March 2006

While these are all excellent ideas I have one question. Why would someone who breaks the rules by calling other players names, hotlinking pictures etc. feel that they should suggest how players who break rules should be punished?

MaJiK · March 2006

I believe with this situation I think there should not be a limit seeing as this is a Virtual Dog Game. But I love VP and truly hate seeing novices & some sponsers (Not All Novices & Sponsers) breeding poorly and saying their dogs are "The Best" or "Top Quality" When then outcome of the litters have poorer (sp?) then imports! This is just my imput though.

Kochise · March 2006

This is just agame! Why have limits? People should be able to breed however they want. What, how, and when they want. If they want to breed, they should be able to breed, regardless. Now, in real life, you don't worry about training, or "stats" do you? So what responsibilty would this show? Yes, they should keep the mood and stuff up, but training?

Rebel912 · March 2006

Kochise wrote:

This is just agame! Why have limits? People should be able to breed however they want. What, how, and when they want. If they want to breed, they should be able to breed, regardless.

True, but its not asking a whole lot to breed for better quality dogs instead of just for money. A big part of this game is to improve the breeds VP has listed, not to just make money breeding.

Kochise wrote:

Now, in real life, you don't worry about training, or "stats" do you?

Uh, yes, yes you do. Training is essential to all dogs: pets, show dogs, working dogs, etc. Plus stats on VP are equal to the conformation of a dog in real life. You breed a dog in RL with bad "stats" then the pups will most likely end up just as bad or worse.

Kochise wrote:

So what responsibilty would this show? Yes, they should keep the mood and stuff up, but training?

I dont really understand how thats even a question... :? Any responsible person would be breeding only to produce better offspring... on VP, the only way to do that is to train.

Kochise · March 2006

I am just saying, in real life, 10 year old kids would have parents to help them train. On here, if a 10 year old does not know anyone, why would they ask? I mean, weren't you ever taught "don't talk to strangers?" I bet a lot of them are being taught that. In real life, no one yells at others because "the dogs stats aren't at 100" Training on here is not teaching how to keep up a real life dog. That is what the question meant. If some kid trained on here, then went to real life and told their parents that they need the dog's stats to 200, their parents would be so confused..... because on here, except for mood and grooming, all things relating to a dog's trianing, are totally different! Except for the commands, but somone just complained how people teach their dogs commands, and that they should just be taken off! So, why is everyone worried about this? People should do this how they want to. Maryam is right. That would totally screw up confo dogs.

Werewolf3 · March 2006

It teaches responsibility by ingraining into the youngster's heads that by working on something rather than taking the easy way out - not training and breeding like crazy - is the better of the two choices. It may not be stats in real life, but real life breeders don't take any dog off the street and breed them. They take professional bred dogs whom usually stick to the standard of a given breed and/or have a partially good show record.

Rebel912 · March 2006

I understand that people should be able to play the game however they want to. However, I also understand that there is a need to decrease the number of untrained/bad stated dogs and increase the number of trained/good stated dogs. So I guess what it all comes down to is which is more important: improving VP dogs and teaching a lesson in responsibility or an individuals rights to play the game how they want.

Newnameplacement · March 2006

what are we voting on?

Kochise · March 2006

Whether or not to put a limit on training stats

Kiarei · March 2006

I'm personally, rather sick of seeing "too many results, please narrow down your search" when I search for dogs for sale or stud of a breed. Sometimes it's impossible to narrow it down any more. If there was a way to decrease the number of untrained/puppy mill dogs on VP, I will support it.

Newnameplacement · March 2006

i'm with kia there

Ravette · March 2006

I'm sorry my feelings on the subject - my dogs my choice. If I want to breed them at -600 stats thats my own choice be I novice or sponsor. I breed untrained dogs all the time when i am trying for a good conformation dog so I feel that this would limit my ability to work for my goal.

Kiarei · April 2006

I'm with Ravette on that one. Though I don't actually breed conformation dogs myself, I do know that an untrained dog=no breeding rule would impair or make impossible their abilities to continue such practices.

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