Breeding mutts on purpose!

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

People who breed mutts on purpose are so stupid. People who buy said mutts for big bucks are even more stupid. :roll: I do my best to educate people between the difference of good breeders and bad breeders. If you are purposefully breeding mutts, you are a bad breeder. If you are breeding purebreds without health testing or working/show titles you are a bad breeder. My grandma thinks it is a good idea to breed her PET Boston Terrier to make money. She thinks it's okay to breed off colors, i.e. red, chocolate, blue, etc. No matter how much I try to educate her, I'm wrong. My uncle thinks it's okay to breed mutts and sell them. For what it's worth, PET Boston Terrier X PET Pug mixes. The only reason they are alive is to make money for him. I try to educate him, but I'm still wrong. I'm called a hypocrite because yes, I am getting a dog from a breeder. I've spent years talking to said breeder and building a relationship with her. She's spent most of her adult life showing her dogs and bettering the breed. They have titles on them. She is a good breeder. She's not breeding dogs to make money. Why can't I get my point across that the two are different. If you want a mutt, go to the shelter and spend $135 on one. They will already have their vaccines and be spayed/neutered as well as other things depending on the shelter or rescue. They make good pets. They aren't damaged somehow. It' just that their previous owners have failed them in some way or another. Yeah, I realize that this rant isn't exactly organized or well thought out but I'm mad. No one understands. :evil: It just feels better to let it out without having someone face to face with me telling me how wrong I am. I don't get into arguements but when I do, I make sure I'm right. I am right. Please be a responsible pet owner and spay or neuter your pet. They aren't money making machines. It's not cool to show your kids the "miracle of life." Believe it or not, those puppies going to "good" homes do end up in shelters. I know. I've seen it happen.

SC`s Stars II · July 2012

I think it depends what one considers a 'mutt' and what breeds the breeding is crossing and for what reasons. Some may do it for temperament or to lessen allergens, etc. I'm not saying you are wrong by any means but I'm also saying it depends on how things are handled in the breeding world. I work at a humane society and I've seen just as many pure breds (some even registered from reputable breeders) come through as I have mutts. Not all breeders who breed mutts are 'bad breeders'. Of course many of them are, and don't know what they're doing and do it only for profit. I really think it depends on how it's handled and what goes into it.

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

When you mix more than one purebred dog, it is a mutt. No dog is hypoallergenic, therefore breeding mixes to "lessen allergens" will do nothing. Labradoodles and cause just as much allergies as a Lhasa Apso. I suppose someone could use two health tested dogs to breed a litter of mixes would be a better breeder than someone who doesn't but that still doesn't make it right.

Adrianna32 · July 2012

I hope this has nothing to do with me saying I breed my Tosas once every two years, if that.

Although according to your definitions, I am a good breeder. xD I understand what you're saying and agree. I watched a "special" today that featured "experts" talking about how designer breeds are being produced in mass for profit. It also talked about how the original designer breed (Labradoodle) creator wishes that his mixed breeding idea hadn't become such a craze. When people just randomly take two house pets and breed them for nothing but the money it's selfish and irresponsible. I don't spay or nueter my show dogs, of course, because I can't. But you won't catch me with an intact mutt or finding a home for an un-nuetered foster. And although I dislike the mass production of mutts, my opinion on mixed dogs themselves are very different. Some of the best dogs I've owned were mutts.

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

I have nothing against the dogs themselves. Don't think I do. I love mutts personally. I've owned more mixed breed dogs than purebred dogs. They've all been spayed and neutered. Nope Zyn, not directed toward you. It's my family. They know I don't agree with them yet they rub it in my face on purpose. It gets me so worked up and they think it's funny. Not funny. All this came about because I met one of the Boston X Pug puppies today. A tad cute, yes. Not for me though. He's going to be ugly when he grows up. lol My mom's roommate bought him so basically my mom bought him. Stupid, stupid, stupid. I can only hope that they get him neutered and not allow some multi generation mutts. What's the point really? My uncle and his "breeding partner" even went as far as to dock the puppies tails. Why? He's a mixed breed dog. Why would someone dock their tails? :roll: Serves no purpose at all. Whatever. I guess I should get over it but it's not easy.

^Oriyana^ · July 2012

Zagari Wolf wrote:

My uncle and his "breeding partner" even went as far as to dock the puppies tails. Why? He's a mixed breed dog. Why would someone dock their tails? :roll: Serves no purpose at all. Whatever. I guess I should get over it but it's not easy.

Ack. When I worked at the vet clinic we docked a litter of Dobes at 2 weeks of age, they had been too sick to do it at the proper age. Now docking at the proper age results in little to no bleeding, and while I'm sure it hurts it doesn't seem to be a hugely traumatic experience for the puppies. Docking at 2 weeks was traumatic for the puppies AND me! Led me to the decision that the only way I'd ever dock tails was if the breed required it for showing and the pups could be done at the right age. Now I'm not so into ear cropping, but part of the that is that it's done at an older age, and to be honest in most breeds I prefer the uncropped look. I love mutts in general, but I believe that if you're not showing your dog you really should spay/neuter regardless of whether it's a mutt or not. And "designer mutts" just ugh :P I don't dislike the dogs themselves since they are blameless lol, I dislike the concept :P

Adrianna32 · July 2012

Ugh. Thank goodness i don't have to deal with stuff like that here. We have a law in this state that all dogs and cats MUST be nuetered/spayed unless health problems prohibit the surgery or the owner holds a legitimate breeding license. If someone I knew was planning a mutt litter for money I'd have the option to call Animal Control about their dogs not being fixed. xD They actually take it seriously here. I haven't seen a single stray yet. You are so right about the dog growing up and being ugly though. When a dog is a tiny puppy he can pull off the smushed face Boston Pug look, but as soon as they're out of the puppy stage they look... unappealing. Atleast to me and you they do. xD When my aunt brought home a Chi-Weenie one day that's exactly what I said, "Stupid stupid stupid". She ended up paying 450 bucks for a dog that yapped so much it got her evicted. -...- Your uncle docked their tails to add to the "so ugly, it's cute" look. O.O I've cropped my game dog's ears with no problem, they were fine in no time. Docking I just cannot do.

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

I don't mind docking and cropping. I actually prefer it on breeds that are traditionally docked and cropped like Dobies, Great Danes, Boxers, Rottweilers, etc. When I worked at the vet I assisted in docking tails and doing dewclaws. It was very interesting and kind of neat. Howver, my vet was very anti ear crop so I never got that experience. What I was getting at was that they are mixed breed dogs for nothing but pets. They have no standard that says their tails need to be docked. They had a 50/50 chance of getting a curly tail like a pug or a short tail like a Boston. It's just stupid. I was also told that they did it at home, not at the vet. I can only imagine how they stopped the bleeding. I've heard horror stories of people using stoves and such.

Adrianna32 · July 2012

Oh goodness. At home docking? Yikes. I read somewhere about some creep selling 'Professional /at home/ ear cropping' to the people in his area. I shuddered when I heard of those stupid enough to take their pups to him, and almost hurled when I found out the cropper was using kitchen scissors! Anywho.. yes, you are correct. Yes, what they did was pointless and stupid.. and i'm pretty sure it was illegal too. (??)

Troglin · July 2012

Zagari Wolf wrote:

I was also told that they did it at home, not at the vet. I can only imagine how they stopped the bleeding. I've heard horror stories of people using stoves and such.

That is so unbelievably disgusting and horrible. I can't imagine a poor puppy having to get its tail cut off with scissors, a knife, or who knows what else people use. I can't imagine them getting it done at a vets office either, but at least it's a sterile environment! As far as how to stop the bleeding, I'm curious how stoves would do it, because I'd imagine that would create one nasty mark for the dogs life. I'm not curious enough to actually look it up, as I don't think I really want to cry if I tried to read about it. I know a lot of people who think they can breed their pets to make big, easy money. They come up with the lamest excuses and defenses. The worst explanation for backyard breeders has to be "If everyone spayed/neutered their animals, we'd have no animals." If you try to explain that spaying/neutering should be for all dogs other than professional show/work/breeding stock, they call you a hypocrite. Sadly people are just closed minded. It would kind of be awesome if the United States could implement a mandatory spay/neuter policy for all pets unless they're medically incapable of having the surgery done or the owner has gotten an approved breeding/showing/working permit. I can see how it would upset people to jump through hoops to keep their animals intact, but maybe it would make them think twice about 'easy money'. I don't know if I ever told you, but my father bought their American Eskimo because he had plans to breed her. He knew nothing about the breed, and he only bought her because she was the first dog he could get. She was purebred, from show stock, but her mother had severe mental issues. She was quite naturally aggressive, despite the breeders efforts to train her out of it. She bit several judges before she was prohibited from shows, and yet the breeder decided to let her have puppies anyway. So my dad paid $250 for a female puppy. He had originally planned to begin breeding her around the age of one, with her having as many litters as she could. He was going to get a male puppy so they would breed every time. Luckily she inherited her mom's unstable temperament, because my dad decided she would probably kill another dog. Sadly it wasn't the same for our numerous female cats. There was a stray tomcat that loved our house. Every few months he'd have access to 2-3 queens. I remember the still births. I remember one of our queens going into premature labor and having seizures for several hours, and being allowed to breed over and over. I remember watching over 140 kittens being born, grow up, and get rehomed. I remember how each person said they would "provide a good home," and I wish I could be ignorant and believe it to be true. My sister in law also believes in breeding pug/schnauzer/chihuahua/random stray mixes for money. She says it's wrong to fix an animal because they should keep what they were born with. Several of the litters were produced by her female's own son, so the pups were severely inbred and had deformities. She still tried to sell them at $300. I jumped down their throats when I visited them last August. The dogs weren't even being fed properly, so they were eating dirty diapers. Animal control in that area doesn't have the funding to do anything. Someday I plan to breed working-lined Belgian Malinois. I've researched the breed extensively and I know where I want to get my first pup from. He'll cost me over a thousand bucks, but he'll be well worth it. When I was trying to explain the whole thing to my older brother/sister in law, they got this look in their eye and told me I'd be "making bank" when my pups got old enough. :roll: Fact of the matter is, some people just think they're above it all. Unfortunately it's difficult to change a persons mind, though I'm sure you know that just from being an APBT advocate. There are people in this world who think of animals as money makers, and as bad as it is, you can't do anything about it unless it turns into criminal negligence or abuse. (Enough abuse/negligence that you can produce substantial evidence in the case.) I know that doesn't help much. It hurts to know people are ignoring you or ignoring the facts. Best thing you can do is try to ignore the irresponsible breeding, unless you can get proof of a crime. Let your grandma/uncle know you want nothing to do with their animals, and that any conversation related to them is not happening. My older brother/sister in law know that I'll rip their tongues out if they dare tell me anything about their dogs, so they've stopped.

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

Now that I have a clearer head, I realize that some working dog breeders cross breeds. I know of a hog hunter who has APBT/Cur/Airedale/??? mix puppies right now. Okay, so to rephrase what I said earlier, if you're breeding your dogs without a real purpose other than to be pets, you're not breeding for the right reasons. The thing about mandatory spay/neuter is that most communities cannot enforce it. I know in my county at least, no one is going to knock on each door and ask for proof of spay/neuter. They just don't care. That's why out shelter closed. Animals are disposable. When this one doesn't turn out like you think, kill it, dump it, sell it and get a new one. Health care is hardly ever provided. It's an "outside" animal. You don't take "outside" animals to the vet. Cats are neglected far more than dogs. We have an outrageous feral cat problem right in the middle of town. It doesn't help any when the people trying to help and TNR the cats, they get attacked because, "If you spay and neuter them all, there won't be any more cats." We really think the owner of the business had other ideas for the cats but I won't get into that. Ana, if you don't mind me asking, you can PM me if you want, where are you planning on getting your first Mal from? I know several owners (online) from a few different breeders. I love the breed but they are definitely too much for me to handle.

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

Oh, and the last time my grandma bred her dog, we got into a huge fight. I didn't talk to her for months. She's also one of the people who think it is cruel to spay/neuter a pet but she doesn't have an issue with docking or removing dewclaws. At least the animal is asleep when they spay and neuter. That's not the case with docking or dewclaws. What makes me really mad about my uncle is that Buddy (his dog) is 11 years old. He comes from a long line of unhealthy dogs. My mom actually bred his litter but it was the one and only time she bred Jewel. All of the dogs in the line (with the exception of Buddy) have died early. Anywhere from 2-8 years of age young. Buddy was my keeper from that litter. I was a young, uneducated kid then. I was excited about puppies. Buddy was registered in my name and still is. Without going into too much detail, my uncle lived with us and when we moved, he kept the dogs. My mom called me up, well, about 4 months ago and told me that my uncle bred Buddy and that I needed to give my uncle Buddy's papers. I said, HELL NO! It wasn't until later that I found out he bred Buddy to a pug so papers were pointless. I hoped and voiced my hope that Buddy was sterile. That got everyone mad at me. My uncle then went out and bought a female Boston Terrier puppy, about 3 months old. I know he plans on breeding her when she'd old enough. If not to Buddy, then to my grandma's dog. In Buddy's case, I'm told that AKC won't register a litter from a stud 12 years and older. So Buddy wouldn't be a good choice. The last time I saw my grandparents, they asked me if I knew that Buddy was a daddy. Because I know they like to pick fights with me, I said yes but I didn't want to talk about it because I wasn't happy about it. I was surprised that they dropped it. If it's not about breeding dogs, it's about their dislike of pit bulls... ugh! I try not to talk most of the time.

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

Wow! Triple post! lol To top it off, not only is Buddy 11 years old, he's also completely blind and deaf. Just thought I'd add that in there.

EmmeZoec · July 2012

*swings twacking shovel around* I hate people that do this. I have only once seen a dog that was mix bred on purpose and have been ok with it. he was a little Border Collie x Jack Russel Terrier bred for high level agility and flyball completions. All others are eoiirvujsa;uovgsru;. It irks me that people are so stupid. Some are so stupid I can barely contain my need to beat them with a stick. Until they stop. Or are brain dead. Just as long as they stop. Now. vssgswggasrwd so mad ._.

Zagari Wolf wrote:

When this one doesn't turn out like you think, kill it, dump it, sell it and get a new one.

The is despicable.

Zagari Wolf wrote:

That's not the case with docking or dewclaws.

Dewclaws can actually become a problem with dogs latter on, it can cause arthritis because of the way dogs run and jump. Let me see if I can find the article...

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

Are you refering the the removal of dewclaws or dogs keeping their dewclaws? In either case, I don't have a problem with them being removed. It would be interesting to read the article though.

EmmeZoec · July 2012

The removal of dewclaws. Let me keep digging through Google and my brain... I know its in there.

EmmeZoec · July 2012

Got it!!! <a href="http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/documents/dewclaws-injury.pdf"; target="_blank" class="bb-url">http://www.woodhavenlabs.com/documents/ ... injury.pdf</a>

Zagari Wolf · July 2012

Very nice read! Thanks for sharing. I will site it in the future for sure.

FlyTM · July 2012

I'v been to lazy to read whats said so this may have been said already, if your in a spot like I have and had no money to get your pet fixed.. I do kinda understand them people, no need to go at me saying I shouldn't own a pet if I can't get it fixed.. its taken me over 5 years maybe longer to get all my cats fixed at last.. I do agree with the bad breeding part and breeding for no reason, I have worked in a shelter and seen the ugly side and the good side of them. Everyday I keep thinking about if I will ever get into breeding and showing ACDs, and if I do it wont be for another 10 years or so.. thats if breeds havn't been so stuff up by than

. The docking and such used to be done for reasons, be now days many people don't have a reason its a look, breeds such as a rottie was used for herding, pulling carts, I don't see people doing that anymore... so really no reason unless you have done some type of breeding can't remember what you would call it, and breed a rottie with a gene to have tail-less pups. Cropping is banned in the country I live in, though I have only ever seen/met one dog here whos ears have been cropped, her owner found her like that though. I do like the look of cropping but than again I wouldn't crop my own dog/s as there is no reason to do so, the only stupidest reason I'v heard is the for when the dogs eye each othere up for a fight they do it by judging of the ears and the crop makes them look bigger?...

Howdy, Stranger!

Breeding mutts on purpose!

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