Attacking or playing?? (your opinion needed!)

Garnet · August 2011

So everyone knows I have an Akita Inu, almost 7 months old, and a pure pitbull, about 2 1/2 months old. Yesterday me and my boyfriend woke up to yelping. I ran outside and my akita had my pits head in his mouth biting on her. shes TINY compared to him!! I don't know if he was playing with her or trying to hurt her! him and his brother used to bite on each other when playing. so do you think he thought he was playing and didnt realize shes too small for him or what?? Im thinking of having him neutered. Would that help his aggressiveness (if thats what it is)we dont want to spayed our pit so we are going to neuter zane lol

Mileysmybaby · August 2011

They -might- have been just playing but you need to watch them to make sure they don't play too rough cause when shes older she will fight back. Why wouldn't you want to neuter your Pit Bull? That might be better then spaying Zane.

Garnet · August 2011

We have them separated now. Faythe had a cut on the top of her head where zane was chewing/biting on her. we are wanting to breed Faythe (the pit) when she grows up so we dont want her spayed, but, we dont want her and zane to breed 0.0 Zane is a beautiful dog and i hate to spayed/neuter either of them but it would be hard to catch faythe in heat every time and we dont want any oopsies with zane. they are both going to be inside dogs. so what if she comes in heat while we are asleep or at work and something happens without us knowing, ya know?

DiamondPuppy0809 · August 2011

I'd definitely neuter Zane, it helps a lot with any behavior. It'd be best to get them both done actually, but males are known to be more dominant if they're not neutered. I'm not too sure about females but I've heard it helps their behavior too. (I automatically get my females/males spayed/neutered as soon as they're the right age, no questions asked.) It'd be almost impossible to keep them apart when she's in heat (probably even if he's neutered) because males automatically know when a female is in heat and will do anything to get to her.

lovefrompaige · August 2011

Garfieldz Gal wrote:

I'd definitely neuter Zane, it helps a lot with any behavior. It'd be best to get them both done actually, but males are known to be more dominant if they're not neutered. I'm not too sure about females but I've heard it helps their behavior too. (I automatically get my females/males spayed/neutered as soon as they're the right age, no questions asked.) It'd be almost impossible to keep them apart when she's in heat (probably even if he's neutered) because males automatically know when a female is in heat and will do anything to get to her.

It makes a female more mellow and less moody. We spayed all 4 of my dogs and both of my cats and they're all chill animals lol I would defiantly do both. There is no reason to not do it unless you plan on breeding. . . But it doesn't seem like you want to breed.

Garnet · August 2011

NO we definitely plan on breeding the pit. our friend has a solid white male that we plan to breed her to when she gets older. we just dont want her to breed with our akita, as we have no idea how the pups would turn out 0.0 i have a female chi that is spayed, and shes chill but super hyper at times! here in the village we can get it done for free so i plan on taking zane SOON. hes already almost 7 months old! He needs it done ASAP D= my chi was spayed at about 2-3 months old.

DiamondPuppy0809 · August 2011

Garnet wrote:

NO we definitely plan on breeding the pit. our friend has a solid white male that we plan to breed her to when she gets older. we just dont want her to breed with our akita, as we have no idea how the pups would turn out 0.0 i have a female chi that is spayed, and shes chill but super hyper at times! here in the village we can get it done for free so i plan on taking zane SOON. hes already almost 7 months old! He needs it done ASAP D= my chi was spayed at about 2-3 months old.

FREE?! It's $120 for a really small male dog here. Or around $240 for a small female. It's the same for cats and rabbits too. What's your purpose in breeding the Pittie?

Garnet · August 2011

Yea My boyfriends mother lives in *removed by staff--don't give out personal info* and if you get a voucher card the vet will do the spaying and stuff for free 0.0 his mom is going to get us a card so we can have it done! it was around $200 to get my chi spayed in texas 0.0 CRAZY lol and my brothers along with my boyfriends dad and uncle said that if we ever bred her they want to buy one of her puppies! We were walking her through the village the other day on one of the trails here and we have like FOUR people give us their numbers and asked if we would call them when she got older!! three want to buy a puppy that is from her and one wants to breed his male pit to her when shes old enough and he said he will pay for the breeding fees and buy a puppy or two 0.0 so we figure we can breed her and sell her puppies and maybe keep a few for us! once we get settled in. we may go into breeding pits for like an extra job

ive ALWAYS loved pits and know lots of people that would want them around here. my boyfriends brother breeds GSD's and he said he will help us and give us everything we need to take great care of her and we have been ding LOTS of research on it to help us decide!

DiamondPuppy0809 · August 2011

Good, for doing all the research and having all the resources. (:

Garnet · August 2011

yea im not one to just jump into something without researching first! my brothers both have always had pits, so i grew up around them. we are going to baby faythe and make her super sweet like the pit, Jordan, that belongs to my next door neighbor down in texas. ive never even heard jordan bark or growl her entire life xD faythe is only 9 weeks old and holds her own against a 8 month old boston terrier, Oakley, he was trying to chase her tail and she turned around and barked at him and showed her teeth a little and he ran off to go play xD it was soooo cute, Oakley's owner, Justin, (brians brother) was like "servevs you right oakley. cant bully her around can you boy!" pet him and then went inside lol

Trianna · August 2011

Your male dog is more likely American Akita than Akita Inu, but either way Akitas are known for being dog aggressive. They tend to work out better in single dog homes. Getting him fixed may help, but you might have to get rid of one of your dogs if he doesn't stop, unless you want a very injured (or maybe dead)dog. Also, I'd recommend getting both dogs fixed anyway. While you may have a very pretty dog, that doesn't mean she should be bred. It'll be expensive if you do it correctly, with all the genetic testing that needs to be done on both dogs. You'll need to have them tested for diseases like brucellosis too. Not to mention proper vet care for the mother during her pregnancy and whelping, and even with proper vet care she can die during the birth, or have complications that could kill her afterward. Plus having baby animals die on you is heartbreaking. Or worse, having one born with defects, either dead, or alive(in which case YOU have to be the one to kill it). When my cat had kittens one of the babies was born completely hairless with under formed facial features and a few organs not in the kitten... It died before it even got it's umbilical cord chewed off. The others lived a few weeks before a problem with their intestines that kept them from properly absorbing nutrients killed them. Do you know what it's like to become attached to a newborn animal, name it, love it, then have it die in your hands? Please read <a href="http://www.tibetanmastiffinfo.com/breeders/Tempted-Tibetan-Mastiff-Info.shtml"; target="_blank" class="bb-url">this</a> before you even consider breeding. There are too many Pit Bulls as it is, with hundreds being euthanized in shelters daily... why breed more? Please don't be a backyard breeder.

EmmeZoec · August 2011

Garnet wrote:

we are wanting to breed Faythe (the pit) when she grows up so we dont want her spayed, but, we dont want her and zane to breed 0.0 Zane is a beautiful dog and i hate to spayed/neuter either of them but it would be hard to catch faythe in heat every time and we dont want any oopsies with zane. they are both going to be inside dogs. so what if she comes in heat while we are asleep or at work and something happens without us knowing, ya know?

Do you know how the canine heat works? As soon as she comes into heat she can't be bred and she wont let males try to breed her. She will only let males bred her when she is in standing heat (when she is ovulating). So if she comes into heat at night work when ever they won't automatically breed but it does mean that if both aren't altered then they will need to be separated for about 2-3 weeks, and that is a horrible 2-3 weeks. Zane could whine and cry all, become aggressive towards whatever he wants to, and do WHATEVER he can to get to her.

Garnet wrote:

my brothers along with my boyfriends dad and uncle said that if we ever bred her they want to buy one of her puppies! We were walking her through the village the other day on one of the trails here and we have like FOUR people give us their numbers and asked if we would call them when she got older!! three want to buy a puppy that is from her and one wants to breed his male pit to her when shes old enough

You really should only bred a dog for YOU\, not to sell for a profit but as a * performance dog* for YOU. Not because other people want puppies or because your dog is *pretty*.

Garnet wrote:

we may go into breeding pits for like an extra job ive ALWAYS loved pits and know lots of people that would want them around here.

Just because you love pits doesn't mean you should breed them. If you are going to bred your dog or anyone is going to bred their dog then it should be to improve the bred. Not for money. If your breeding your dog correctly you will make no money or even lose money. Is your female even tested? Are you even going to get your female tested?

Garnet · August 2011

I didn't make this post and tell you guys my thoughts to be "judged" on it. I stated that i loved pits and wanted to breed her for ourselves. If others want puppies then they can have one. Both our dogs have been to the vet regularly and are up to date on everything they need and I've already spoke to a vet about what would need to be taking care of before breeding Faythe. Not to mention I DID state

we may go into breeding pits

. No where did I ever say it was a 100% guarantee that we would breed her. @Trianna: Yes, I understand there are plenty of pit bulls in the world and plenty are euthanized every day. Is that my fault? No, it isn't. That's the same as telling people "Don't have a baby! Their are too many humans in the world already, with lots dying every day" Why get married and have kids when there are already MILLIONS in the world today, with many being sickly, due to not having the right living conditions and world hunger? You don't see people getting feisty about humans breeding EVERY day to create more of an already overflowing population. Anyways I'm not getting into a fight over this as everyone has VERY different opinions when it come's to pit bulls. Yes, I know what it's like to hold an animal i was very attached to as it died. I've had it happen before. If we plan to breed Faythe in the future then she will have everything she needs, provided to her by the Vet and myself, to ensure that everything goes as well as God intends for it to. I've seen kittens run under a moving vehicle because they were playing and the person driving couldn't see them as she was backing up in time to stop. I've had to watch my own puppy be euthanized because of medical conditions that the vet had no means of reversing. So yes, I know what that is like. To any other negative comments. Please save yourself the time, as I stated above I have already talked to the village vet and she told me everything that would go into breeding her and the necessary tests that would have to be performed and the things that would be needed/required.

Mileysmybaby · August 2011

Yes, I understand there are plenty of pit bulls in the world and plenty are euthanized every day. Is that my fault? No, it isn't. That's the same as telling people "Don't have a baby! Their are too many humans in the world already, with lots dying every day" Why get married and have kids when there are already MILLIONS in the world today, with many being sickly, due to not having the right living conditions and world hunger? You don't see people getting feisty about humans breeding EVERY day to create more of an already overflowing population.

This is two very different things.

DiamondPuppy0809 · August 2011

I think this post should be deleted or locked or something...

Garnet · August 2011

No need for it to be locked. I'm not arguing with anyone lol Everyone has different opinions on things. In my opinion it's the same thing. We over populate humans just as much as dogs =( To others, they may be different things all together. We are all mammals and of the animal kingdom. I'm not going to argue with people over that. This post is me asking what I should do with ZANE biting the puppy. Not breeding dogs. I was asked a question and I answered it with my opinion =(

FlyTM · August 2011

Mysterous Love wrote:

Yes, I understand there are plenty of pit bulls in the world and plenty are euthanized every day. Is that my fault? No, it isn't. That's the same as telling people "Don't have a baby! Their are too many humans in the world already, with lots dying every day" Why get married and have kids when there are already MILLIONS in the world today, with many being sickly, due to not having the right living conditions and world hunger? You don't see people getting feisty about humans breeding EVERY day to create more of an already overflowing population.

 This is two very different things.

Sorry, but I have to say something, I am with Garnet with that... and I think if we can fix dogs, half them humans should be fixed as well. *Edit* I think its best to get both fixed, unless you know the people who are wanting a pup will stay to their word and know what they are getting for picking a pitbull as the breed they want.

HWRD2 · August 2011

Wel the only thing I would think, is both akita's and pitbulls are more of a "dominanat" breed. Due to this if both dogs are getting up in age, they might start "duking" it out to show each other which is more dominant. Sometimes this never stops and sometimes it only happens one time then they are fine with each other. But they could have also been playing like you said, sometimes it is quite hard to tell and I know that both breeds have an issue with not really knowing their own strength. I would say just be careful. ^_^

Alabama · August 2011

Just my opinion, but honestly, I feel unless dogs are purebred, papered, fully vetted, as in down to testing for any genetic defects and for temperament by a professional, AND they are shown, they should be spayed or neutered, as responsible pet owners. A single dog can have hundreds of pups in its lifetime, its pups hundreds more. Sure, you don't intend to breed 100 pups, but if just one of your pups gets into the wrong hands, it can be done, so why take the chance. In a year, a single one of your female pups might whelp up to 24 pups. Humans cannot do that. Most don't do that even in a lifetime. If you let a male pup go, he might sire hundreds of pups in a year. Only a small percentage of human children are placed into fighting rings. Only a small percentage of children are abandoned on the roadside and left to die of hunger and neglect. If just of one of the pups gets into the wrong hands, by whatever means and bites someone, it gives the breed an even worse name than it already has. Why risk that? To me, people who want to breed for themselves or to make a little money do it for vanity or out of ignorance, not for the dog and not for the breed. No one is force to spay and neuter their dogs, just as no one is forced to get spayed themselves. If we are responsible people, we act responsibly. We don't have children we don't want, and we don't have puppies that we can guarantee what their entire lives will be like. The problem with your dogs most likely won't be resolved by neutering the female if it was an aggressive, though limited attack. She is already mature and already has learned her path. The only thing that will resolve it is training of both dogs. However, if you do not neuter both of them, the problems will only persist and most likely get worse as the male begins producing testosterone and becomes more territorial and starts challenging the female for attention or control. Again, training is the only thing that has a chance at fixing this if you do not spay and neuter before the animal reaches maturity.

Garnet · August 2011

Thanks guys! I talked to Brian after all this and we are thinking that IF we decide to breed Faythe we will only allow her pups to go to family or really close personal friends that we see a lot. So that we can make sure of how the puppies are raised

I do get that humans are VERY different than dogs in the way they breed

my only point was that we have children starving, being abused, and over populated in some countries; just as we have dogs abused/etc, ya know? Bama I'm not sure if you didn't understand me or I'm not understanding you lol! xD Faythe isn't the one that "attacked" she was the one that got bitten by the male

She bares her teeth when playing but she's never bitten. She will chew on my arm when im scratching her (like nibbling with the very tip of her teeth against my arm) and that's it, other than that she licks us

Alabama · August 2011

I probably understood you, but got the genders wrong in the 2 hours it took to write the reply between interruptions

but the advice really does count towards both, which ever is causing the problem. I'm not as familiar with Akitas, but pit bulls are well known to be territorial, why they make good guard and family dogs when trained, understood and socialized correctly. But if the older male is showing aggression, neutering him won't make him stop at this point in the game, though it might take the testosterone out that can escalate the situation. When the pit bull female grows up, she'll also have a tendency to want to rule the roost, so to speak, which means though she's kind and gentle with you and other humans, she may try to enforce what your other dog(s) do and don't do, which they in turn may not like. She may even become a very fierce mother towards other dogs, not wanting them to even be in the house once her pups are born. It'll take training for both of them as well as a lot of supervision or separation when they can't be supervised. I'll be honest, you really should make the decision about whether or not to breed the female long before she comes into her first heat. Which means before she turns into an adult. I would strongly advise against breeding, even if it's just to give pups to family and close friends. The health benefits, from a significantly lower percentage of chance of reproductive cancers to more stable hormones making for a better pet, far outweigh the positives of having cute puppies which come with their own health risks to both mother and puppies. Babying a dog is not the way to guarantee it will be sweet. Look at the many popular lap dogs who are vicious and mean from being babied all their life and believing they rule. I'm not sure if your Akita was or wasn't showing aggression, but if so, then it may need less babying and more strict guidelines and rules. If any of your family and friends don't properly educate both themselves and their puppy with training and proper socialization, it can come to a bad end for which you might get blamed or you may not agree with the way they are raising the pup and rightly or wrongly, it can create havoc within the family or break friendships. I promise, I don't mean this personally, I've told friends and neighbors the exact same thing any time they talk about breeding their own dogs. I flat out read the riot act to my husband over our newest dog and then lectured the guy who gave us the puppy to get his dog neutered before any more "accidents" happen with his neighbor's dog. (This after he commented he'd given us a male so that if it got loose, we wouldn't have to worry about the puppies) If I knew his neighbor, I'd tell them the same thing. Almost every dog I've owned, I've been asked if I would breed because the dog was exceptionally intelligent or exceptionally marked/colored or whatever and they'd like to have a puppy from them. I take it as flattery through ignorance, but am more than delighted to say it's impossible because it was spayed/neutered before 6 months old and for an opportunity to enlighten them on the virtues of having a neutered or spayed dog as well as the detriments of not having them "fixed" as soon as possible. This includes the two purebred, papered dogs I've owned.

Trianna · August 2011

I also want to point out I wasn't trying to be mean, just blunt and to the point. As for knowing if your dogs were just playing, or if Zane was attacking.... <a href="http://companionanimalsolutions.com/blogs/dogdog-aggression-or-is-it/"; target="_blank" class="bb-url">this</a> and <a href="http://www.wagntrain.com/BodyLanguage.htm"; target="_blank" class="bb-url">this</a> might help. You also might want to read <a href="http://www.baycrestakitas.com/2006/myths.htm"; target="_blank" class="bb-url">this</a> and some other information about Akitas. I can kinda paraphrase some info, as Akita Inus are one of the breeds my hubby and I are interested in. Akitas are a guardian breed, so they tend to be very instinctively territorial. They were originally bred as fighting dogs, and they were also used to hunt deer, boars, and bears, or a guard dogs. Personality wise, they are dominant, and very often aggressive. They aren't people pleasing dogs, and are very intelligent and independent. They bore easily without enough stimulation, and can become quite destructive. They normally have a high prey drive, and need to be in a fenced area or on leash at all times. Most importantly in your case, they can often be VERY dog aggressive, to the point of killing other dogs. You may end up having to get rid of one of your dogs, as both breeds you currently have are dominant, often dog aggressive breeds that have fighting breed into them. Zane could easily reach 100 pounds, and Faythe could reach 50 pounds or more. If they were to get in a fight when they get older they would be extremely hard to separate, and you could end up with two seriously injured dogs with huge vet bills, or one seriously injured dog and one dead dog. There is also a pretty large chance that Zane will be aggressive toward people, and may attack anyone he doesn't know who comes onto your property. Also, if you are currently trying to buy a house it could be hard to get an insurance policy for the house with two breeds of dog that are often viewed as a liability. Without a homeowners policy you will be turned down for a mortgage. If you want to keep both dogs I really would recommend getting both of them fixed and socializing them like crazy while you still have the chance, although that may be a bit late for Zane. If he is showing signs of dog aggression then you may have to keep the dogs separated at all times, and do some behavior modification training with Zane. I'd recommend getting a muzzle, also, for times when being in close proximity to other dogs is something you can't avoid i.e. going to the vets. If you do chose to get rid of one of the dogs then a single dog household or contacting a rescue organization, especially in the case of Zane, would probably be the best call.

Garnet · August 2011

@Bama: Yea we are still talking about it. I kinda want BOTH of them neutered, but I told Brian that in the end. Faythe's breeding was HIS choice cause I bought her strictly for HIM, ya know? I told him all what you said and the others and that i didn't know if it would be best, but I told him that i want him to decide in the end. I promised him that anything to do with Faythe would be his say in the end and i would only tell him my suggestions and opinions and let him choose

Thank you for your info though! The poor baby looks so sad not being inside all the time now!!! I'm ready for her to be back in bed with us at night.. I miss feeling her stretch against my side and her jumping on me to wake me up when she has to go out xD When she's gotta pee or something, she will literally pounce on my side and nibble at my ears till i wake up then start wagging her tail and pawing at me when i look at her! its sooo adorable! @Trianna: Thank you for the links! I'm sorry if my post seemed rude back to you 0.0 I really was trying to not fight with anyone

Zane isn't full Akita. His mother (my friends dog) was a full blooded Akita Inu that her dad bought her. His dad was a full blooded Black Lab. So He's part Akita and part Lab

Me personally, after thinking on it for the passed few days. I'm thinking he was just playing. When his brother was still alive (he passed away in march due to parvo...) they would chew and tug on each others ears and when they played they would bite each other on the snout until one yelped then they would stop, which is what happened with Faythe. When she yelped Zane instantly let go and stepped back. I forgotten that him and his brother played that way till I saw a video on Brian's phone of them playing when they were little. I know I am for sure getting Zane neutered. I have him around people a lot and other dogs as much as possible. Their isn't a dog park nearby =( One of my friends ran up in the yard and instead of barking at them, he tucked his tail and ran to me and sat between my legs. My boyfriend brother came in from school and Zane had gotten loose while we were are work and he started licking Clay and playing with Clay like he had known him forever and Clay said he never once growled or tried to bite him 0.0 Is that a good sign??

Trianna · August 2011

As long as it was actually playing, and he isn't being territorial or showing signs of aggression toward people he may be taking more after the lab than the akita. You'll just have to wait and see. With proper socialization and training he should be fine, but if he starts showing signs of aggression you'll just have to be careful with new people and animals meeting him, and probably keep him separate from other dogs when you aren't around. Keeping him on leash at all times he's not in an enclosed area is probably a good idea too, just in case the akita independence kicks in and he won't respond to a recall command.

Garnet · August 2011

Alright. I'll keep an eye on him! Right now hes in a 10x10 kennel outside with a dog house, HUGE tub of water, and a shade tree in the middle of it while we are working. We feed them both once in the morning. once before work. and once when we get off work. and take them BOTH out all three times and let them play for about 30 minutes to an hour before putting them back inside the kennel. here in the village their are trails and stuff through the mountains (well populated trails) and we walk them both down those as much as we can! =D I really hope he sticks to the lab instinct more than his mothers. I noticed though, that even his mother was super friendly to strangers 0.0 The first time i ever saw her, she had her three puppies (Zane and Shadow and their sister Sadie) by her side and she walked right up to me and put her head on my knee to be scratch and I'd never seen her before then lol! she was HUGE, but she was beautiful!

Trianna · August 2011

Well, breed standards aren't true for every member of the breed, so perhaps the mother was just one of the more mellow akitas. Hopefully Zane turns out to be a calm, non aggressive dog too

Garnet · August 2011

I'm hoping so too! Kita (the mother dog, my friend named her that haha) got into lots of fights with neighbors dog, but the neighbors dog was VERY vicious even towards humans 0.0

Heartless Riku · August 2011

It sounds like they were just playing to me, Garnet

If you decided to breed them, it's up to you. I wouldn't listen to what anyone else says, because it's not their dogs. For my situation, in a way, I regret neutering Rocky because it only made him fatter, and he gets plenty of exercise and food daily. Also, it didn't help his behavior at all, he's still aggressive. From what I've seen in person, and every where else, training is what makes a difference. We trained rocky to be aggressive because people steal dogs over here, since the county I live in a county that has multiple gangs activity. Who would do anything to get money, such as robbing house, nice dogs, etc. Many of my friends had their dogs stolen and sold off, because they were friendly dogs. And the cops don't do anything about it here. And some crazy lady tried to steal rocky out my hands he was a year old in a pet store. Plus, I don't like people touching my dog without asking. Plus, we pretty much neutered him because the Vet told us that it will help him not get cancer. Yet, now we're worried that he'll end up with possible arthritis, high blood pressure, heart attack,diabetes, etc. I just love the trade off, it's like we only up'd his chances of getting sick.

Garnet · August 2011

Awwww Lyc

it's not ya'lls fault

Those things happen. You saved him from cancer by doing it! Thank you for your support. In all honesty I think the same thing but I didn't wanna get anything started and i do see some of the logic behind it and im taking all statements into consideration

Heartless Riku · August 2011

Yeah

I had to many family members die from cancer, and it will kill me to see him go through it. Now it only hurts me to see him going through what I'm going through. And no problem

Yeah I know what you mean.

Garnet · August 2011

I've never had that happen so I have no idea what you went through =( I wish there was some way to people's pain go away 0.0 That would be awesome

Howdy, Stranger!

Attacking or playing?? (your opinion needed!)

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